General Forum
Start a New Topic 
Author
Comment
View Entire Thread
Right-o ...


Good call on the mecha overlooking the valley ... I'm not quite up on my obscure mecha.



As for the Reflex Point remark, I was thinking the exact same thing as I flipped through my copy of the book this afternoon. Apparently I was so dazzled by the opening scene on my computer screen that I missed the ramifications of what Yune & Faerber's script was saying.



Of course, my line of thought was much simpler ... let's see, in "Force of Arms", Rick and Lisa escape from Alaska Base and catch sight of the SDF-1 falling. They see where it lands and speed towards it. So it's gotta be somewhere in the northwestern U.S. or southwestern Canada.



Every map of Reflex Point in New Gen, on the other hand, shows it in the eastern half of the U.S., usually somewhere around Ohio.



Hmm ... the northwestern U.S. and Ohio are two different things. Sorry, Mr. Yune and Mr. Faerber, but ... BZZZZZZZZZZT, wrong answer.



On the plus side, tho, Dana in CVR-3 battle armor and a young Jonathan Wolfe rescuing an even younger Max Sterling were cute touches. Also quite liked the Udon guys' rendering of Breetai. On the downside, the ominous Miriya reveal scene ... ehh, while it doesn't totally bungle continuity (not like, say, RtM's Khyron crap), it does suggest a greater degree of familiarity between the central Zentraedi in the series than the series itself suggests.



As for the backup ... cute, but does EVERY Robotech story Wildstorm publishes have to start with the SDF-1 crashing? Oh wait, the main story started with the Invid Invasion ... though despite the effects in the second panel, the first panel's visuals, along with its "At the dawn of the new millenium" narration (GACKKKK, RT3K promo flashbacks, GEEEYARGH), had me initially thinking otherwise.



Bloody hell, I need a drink ... *sigh* ... and I thought Yune would make my duty EASY.



JLS

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:


Oh yeah, and another thing about the Reflex Point thing. If you try to understand Mr. Yune's reasoning, it seems that his thinking is that the Invid would settle on the place where they could get the Protoculture Matrix and its energy. But there is no evidence that the Invid would require a Protoculture Matrix or that they would create their headquarters base on the exact location of the containment structures of the Matrix. What we do know is that the Invid require the Flowers of Life first and foremost. Well, prevailing winds go eastward, blowing the spores of the Flowers of Life right to where they should be according to rough map coordinates.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

There is little to celebrate here.



This might only matter to a HC robotech fan like me, but the opening of this comic has UTTERLY DESTROYED Harmony Gold's canon integrity. According to Tom Bateman, a man I greatly respect, HG's definition of the Robotech canon consists of the 85-episode series and these new comics. Thus, it's damaging to the idea that both are canon when they contradict one another. Furthermore, it renders HG hypocritical: They said they decanonized the old novels and comics because they were inconsistant with the series and each other. There have already been other minor contradictions (Errenously rendered dialogue and uniforms in flashbacks compared to flashbacks in "A Rainy Night" and contradictory visuals of Macross Island in 2005, ect.). But this is one contradiction which cannot be ignored, and has implications for the whole of Robotech.



Simply stated, Reflex Point CANNOT be the same thing as the mounds/containment structures in Southern Cross.



Fact: Nobody ever referred to the tomb of the SDF-1 as "Reflex Point" during the Southern Cross series.



Fact: According to Robotech.com's Infopedia, the mounds/containment structures were designed to hide away the Protoculture Matrix.



Fact: The ASC's leadership demonstrated complete ignorance of the Masters' plans to retrieve the Matrix despite knowing early on about the Masters' escavations of the SDF-1 ruins. It's clear that Mr. Yune has decided Leonard is a traitor, but does he also believe that the ASC is brain dead?



Fact: General Emerson, ASC Chief of Staff, and his staff debated all night the reasons for the Masters' escavations there in "Half Moon". It was suggested that they were space pirates looking for salvage and other such fanciful ideas. At the end of the night, Colonel Rochelle told Emerson point blank that they were no closer to a solution, that they still did not have the faintest idea what the Masters were up to there, or why. If they knew the Matrix was there, alarm bells would have gone off in their heads.



Fact: The mounds have a tall range of mountains nearby, and no river flowing close. The mounds are located at the location of New Macross City, which is seen to have buttes nearby. These buttes are only present in the Western United States.



Fact: The Invid Reflex Point is seen to be surrounded by thick forests with a river running nearby. Mountains nearby are distant, and shallow. Maps of Reflex Point vary in consistancy, but each and every one in the series and OSM places it in Eastern North America.



So, Mr. Yune, HG creative director, who I continue to admire a great deal for his artwork and his exempliary conduct at Robotech.com and in the community, has embraced a story element which contradicts the series and damages the idea of Robotech possessing a canon. What are fans who were told that the novels and comics they enjoy were thrown out because they were contradictory supposed to say now?



I realize the people here are more fans of Robotech material than the hardcore continuity aspects, but I hope you can understand my dismay at what this portends. I am further saddened because this piece has the most dramatic and one of the best illustrated openings of any Robotech comic, past or present. It's well-crafted, yet contains a massive contradiction.



BTW- That large, twin barreled *Hovertank* isn't a *Hovertank*. It's actually a treat for that under other circumstances would have made me delighted. That mech is a Tiger, an original, but unproduced Genesis Climber Mospeda design for a Mars Base ground mecha. In Robotech terms, it would be a heavy Destroid of the Robotech Expeditionary Force, perhaps their equivilant of the MAC II (Monster) in the RDF during the First Robotech War.

Re: Right-o ...

That's not the SDF-1, JLS. It's actually a Zentraedi ship...it's green, and with a single hull, not double. I guess the giants in the movie are supposed to be Zentraedi.



As for the SDF-1's landing, there is no reason it couldn't have taken off again after it picked up Rick and Lisa. But buttes are such a rare geological phenomenon, present only where millions of years of erosion has taken place, that it seems unlikely the SDF-1 is in Canada or the Eastern US. I know there are buttes in Idaho, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, and Arizona. There might be some in Southern Canada though, I'm not sure.



Reflex Point's main hive (as opposed to central) might be in Western New York. That's because Ohio is flat as a board and Reflex Point has a few shallow mountains nearby. There is a hive near Buffalo as seen on the map in "Reflex Point", and Western New York is fairly mountainous. This also conviently explains why Team Bernard took such a detour to New York City, and why Scott said upon their departure that Reflex Point was probably only a few hours away!

Re: No. No. No.


I noticed the contradiction aswell when I looked at those scans. Im looking at these mounds and saying to myself "What? Thats not Reflex Point!" I'd like to see what HG's explination for this is.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Replying to:

There is little to celebrate here.



This might only matter to a HC robotech fan like me, but the opening of this comic has UTTERLY DESTROYED Harmony Gold's canon integrity. According to Tom Bateman, a man I greatly respect, HG's definition of the Robotech canon consists of the 85-episode series and these new comics. Thus, it's damaging to the idea that both are canon when they contradict one another. Furthermore, it renders HG hypocritical: They said they decanonized the old novels and comics because they were inconsistant with the series and each other. There have already been other minor contradictions (Errenously rendered dialogue and uniforms in flashbacks compared to flashbacks in "A Rainy Night" and contradictory visuals of Macross Island in 2005, ect.). But this is one contradiction which cannot be ignored, and has implications for the whole of Robotech.



Simply stated, Reflex Point CANNOT be the same thing as the mounds/containment structures in Southern Cross.



Fact: Nobody ever referred to the tomb of the SDF-1 as "Reflex Point" during the Southern Cross series.



Fact: According to Robotech.com's Infopedia, the mounds/containment structures were designed to hide away the Protoculture Matrix.



Fact: The ASC's leadership demonstrated complete ignorance of the Masters' plans to retrieve the Matrix despite knowing early on about the Masters' escavations of the SDF-1 ruins. It's clear that Mr. Yune has decided Leonard is a traitor, but does he also believe that the ASC is brain dead?



Fact: General Emerson, ASC Chief of Staff, and his staff debated all night the reasons for the Masters' escavations there in "Half Moon". It was suggested that they were space pirates looking for salvage and other such fanciful ideas. At the end of the night, Colonel Rochelle told Emerson point blank that they were no closer to a solution, that they still did not have the faintest idea what the Masters were up to there, or why. If they knew the Matrix was there, alarm bells would have gone off in their heads.



Fact: The mounds have a tall range of mountains nearby, and no river flowing close. The mounds are located at the location of New Macross City, which is seen to have buttes nearby. These buttes are only present in the Western United States.



Fact: The Invid Reflex Point is seen to be surrounded by thick forests with a river running nearby. Mountains nearby are distant, and shallow. Maps of Reflex Point vary in consistancy, but each and every one in the series and OSM places it in Eastern North America.



So, Mr. Yune, HG creative director, who I continue to admire a great deal for his artwork and his exempliary conduct at Robotech.com and in the community, has embraced a story element which contradicts the series and damages the idea of Robotech possessing a canon. What are fans who were told that the novels and comics they enjoy were thrown out because they were contradictory supposed to say now?



I realize the people here are more fans of Robotech material than the hardcore continuity aspects, but I hope you can understand my dismay at what this portends. I am further saddened because this piece has the most dramatic and one of the best illustrated openings of any Robotech comic, past or present. It's well-crafted, yet contains a massive contradiction.



BTW- That large, twin barreled *Hovertank* isn't a *Hovertank*. It's actually a treat for that under other circumstances would have made me delighted. That mech is a Tiger, an original, but unproduced Genesis Climber Mospeda design for a Mars Base ground mecha. In Robotech terms, it would be a heavy Destroid of the Robotech Expeditionary Force, perhaps their equivilant of the MAC II (Monster) in the RDF during the First Robotech War.